EXPOSED: The Secret Power Play Behind Cleveland's Ward Changes 🔥

00:00:00 [Music] ladies and gentlemen you’re rocking with a goat K Dow giving you motivation for growth two toes down he keep it realer than most he do it for the culture that’s always the goal giving inspiration through information providing Liberation with conversation giving fresh insight for elevation cuz he knows this is how we reach our greatness and he riding with the people of all walks of life cuz we all can V so when when we all win so we all in this is how we build community you dig so tap in I will do it now you want

00:00:34 answers he will break them down the most informative place around this is strategic moves with [Music] Kow this is strategic moves with Kow this is strategic mow [Music] been doing it in this city for over 25 years and we want to make your next move a strategic move so this program gives me opportunity to bring on people to do just that we talk about some of our experiences we give some of our information that we learned over the years and hopefully it’s something you can get out of it that’ll help you with

00:01:20 your business or your personal life so if that sound like some you’re interested and all I need you to do is hit the like button hit the Subscribe button and the notification Bell as well so that you’ll know the next time this program is coming in on we’re going to get right to it today because the program today is going to be an interesting program we’re going to talk a little bit about re districting and we had a thing that was on the ballot this year was called citizens not politicians where they were putting on the ballot to

00:01:46 go ahead and allow people to pick out how we draw the districts of our representation as related to state and federal candidates the city of Cleveland is going under something similar to that right now and they’re going to be doing some redistricting of some of the awards in their community and there’s been some critics out here who seem to believe that system is not being done transparently as well as it’s being done to eliminate certain people that people may not seem to like so what we’re going

00:02:17 to do is we’re going to talk a little bit about that with one of the city council’s dean of council he’s the longest serving council member in Cleveland City Council he done been through several of these transitions as we done transition through over the years and he’s going to talk a little bit about that as we go into that and but before we get going I want to bring on the podcast producer who helps put this whole program together DJ TR what’s up brother he’s back there making all this stuff happen for us to get things

00:02:46 going he’s in the command center you got anything you want to say before we get started redistricting is where we at today opinion why in your opinion this is such a Hot Topic why can’t we get right I think they trying to get it right and we gonna find out about that that and I think every time anybody feels they losing something everybody always got a problem with it so everybody can’t be happy by in the sandbox and you come over there and start playing with or their lunch P or they shovel D it gets a

00:03:21 little sticky as it that’s how it go let’s call that’s why it’s called politics little sticky so let’s get going thank you councilman Michael pesic for joining us on our program today it’s honor for you to be here today and we look forward to this conversation thank you that’s it this will be my fourth redistricting process no one has done it longer than me I’m the senior member of council and obviously the longest serving member in in Cleveland’s history as a member of Cleveland City Council so why don’t you

00:03:53 give us your little stump speech man give me that five minute stump speech councilman Mike pin how you started out where this was my I tell you it’s where I started out in 1967 okay my mother who was right you know what I was born in 1967 thank you you’re he made me very old down in 1957 I was in high school okay and my mother was with a group of Eastern European women ethnic ladies and men who were supporting Carl Stokes and my mom asked me to pass out literature for Carl Stokes okay on four streets off of St

00:04:26 Clair and I didn’t even know who KL Stokes was wow okay I at that at my age I was a teenager the only thing I was three things I was worried about was girls football and cars and all depended what what day of the week it was order pull your mic down just look I want be able to see yeah there we my so I passed out stuff on four streets off of St Clair and I remember those streets very vividly that was my first experience in politics my mother was a street captain of the 9M Civic Club in the day my mother was born in Glennville

00:04:54 neighbor as I was and at the end of the day I got involved in the UAW at White on St clar you white trucks MH and it was through the UAW Local 32 that I got involved in politics and one thing led to another and became a member of Cleveland City Council November of let me see let me get November of 1977 I was elect wow did you run against somebody or did you get a point how did you get I beat an incumbent I beat a very uh popular incumbent who was well known the last Republican incl city council I won

00:05:28 and I won I was very fortunate the same year Mike White got elected and and a group of us young guys with money yes so that that time we had 33 members of city council so that’s why I can I understand I can relate to all it corre we went from 33 MH to now we’re being faced with 15 w wow so what the public at least those public the public has paid attention over the in November of 19 I’m trying I had to write down here I remember November of 2000 issue to 39 man it was voted upon by the people of the city of Cleveland okay by

00:06:06 60% parity the 40% voted know that they would tie the population of the city to the number Council people wow so here we are today so we went from 33 we’re going to be fa we’re now 17 we’re going to be faced with 15 at the end of next year and so we’ve gone a long way and so I tell people this all the time Kenny that be careful what you vote for read the Ballon language just like with the all this uage now and outrage about issue 24 was the citizens police commission the majority people never read it and then

00:06:40 they Wonder well how could this tro take more take authority away from the mayor okay and the saf Chief it was right there it was embodied in the in the in the the B language but the majority people voted for it because it was framed there was going to be police reform civilian oversight right so that’s why I vote happened I told people that’s why I vote absentee so I can sit there and read it at home the ballot language I know what I’m voting for so regardless of how people feel about this reduction of 15 the people voted for it

00:07:12 and here we’re and here we are we’re confronted with so let’s go back a little bit cuz you said we started out at 33 yes what reduced what made them reduce from 33 what was it was again it would ballot language it went from 33 to 21 and you got to step back a moment the city council the chamber and many people have been it’s a magnificent chamber beautiful it was designed for 50 council members okay there was a belief in the 30s and the 40s that Cleveland which was hel heralded right up there with New

00:07:44 York Chicago San Francisco Etc that we would continue to grow in population and we’d be well over a million people okay and as a result we would have 50 Council People based on the charter mhm that never happened the population continue to decrease especially in the ‘ 70s especially started the decrease in in in substance so here we are today so we have just around 376,000 whatever it is thousand people in City Cleveland when I came in we were close just under we were on just under 700,000 people so is it a a federal

00:08:21 thing or is it something it’s a charter it’s a charter issue is a charter it’s mated every decade every 10 years every all right so there we go so every 10 years sir we have to look at the fact that Council need to take a look at whether or not it should be reduced based off population and that’s and not even look take a look at it’s clearly in the charter that they tied yes it’s tied to population so if we drop below just because I wrote some of my notes down if we drop below 325,000 the city we’ll go

00:08:49 down to 13 okay now if we should go back up if we go over 375,000 we’ll pick up two more we go back up to 177 which we are now okay but no doubt about it there is a there’s pain at the pump and I can tell you that no one likes it especially those of us who’ve been through it I’ve been through it longer than anybody four times so a domino so when you start moving lines Cleveland is not a square or a rectangle it’s almost like a boomerang okay or it’s weird shaped so when you start pushing in start drawing W lines

00:09:25 there’s a collision as you come in from the West Side Lee Harvard M pleas you come from Old Brooklyn when you come in from Colwood West Park there’s a collision and so not only is there a collision on Wards and neighborhoods but also there’s a thing called the voting RS act okay which has to be respected as well so you can so let’s talk about that a little bit you say that when you say that’s one of the biggest issues that has to be revolved in there what’s a little bit of how you cannot disenfranchise any citizen any BL of

00:09:53 Citizen okay so the Hispanic community on the West Side you can’t so when I was council president in 2000 I drew the Hispanic Ward because if not we were going to get sued under the Voting Rights Act so I drew that Hispanic W and I’m very proud of that fact I sat down with Hispanic leaders I said the community and we were able to frame that W and put as many members of the Hispanic community in that one Ward so you have to work around that as well when you start coming in from the West Side there’s that Collision it’s like a

00:10:24 big seat you got or horseshoe you got to go around the Hispanic community so then that affect everything and then when you move in from again Lee Harvard Mount Pleasant when you move in from Colwood Glenville you start to have this Collision of Ward bound Fe so that’s the challenge for us so the the comments that were made directed against the council president bla Griffin I thought we’re totally out of place when I went in I’ve met with the consultant twice uhhuh when I went in the first time and

00:10:53 I asked the consultant was any council person or any Ward being sing k out for extinction MH told me absolutely not and I said it better not be because see I know what that was like I went through that I went through that in the ler districting the efforts that were made to carve up the East Side really uh if it was a disaster what they did to us on east side and that’s why four council members councilman Jeff Johnson now judge uh Joe cerman Kevin C and myself all four of us voted against that last

00:11:26 redistricting because what it did to the side not only did it just draw these crazy Ward lines talk about Jerry man here everyone has heard the term Jerry man but it was also meant to the Press voting it was voter suppression yeah and during that time I remember Conwell going through it because I believe he was sick during that point he was going he was dealing with cancer deal with cancer and I remember him being at home and getting the call that him and they were trying to put him and Jeff Johnson

00:11:57 they wanted to kill both they wanted to kill both of them and get him out of office at that time and the person who ended up getting Jeff ended up running in Collinwood and and taking on Eugene Miller and Kevin ended up standing but I remember that was a process that people didn’t think too highly of and a lot of council members had issues with them oh yeah and and it’s been framed over the years to really it was framed that somehow they wanted to protect Eugene Miller then councilman yes and to some

00:12:26 extent they did but at the end of the day what it really was you touch on it they wanted to really hurt number one he wanted to hurt Jeff Johnson Jeff Johnson then Conwell they couldn’t do too much to me but what did they do they drew this crazy W and then they took my ward number and moved it all the way to the West Side wow so that’s the kind of crap that went on and it was about voter suppression so when you look at how people are voting on the east side of the city again it’s diminished because

00:12:57 they’ve caused Great confusion that was potential and and people got to wonder about that cuz we watch that stuff and I will say I cuz this where I’m in councilman Marty sweene was the council president during that time and Sweeny is over there at County Council right now doing some things over there so people better be watching what y’all vote and your people you work with that was deliberate that was deliberate to suppress voting on the east side to cause confusion and it worked I will tell you right now it worked that’s

00:13:23 corre and we were fortunate and I will be the first one to say that that Jeff Johnson Kevin Conwell myself and Joe serman we sat down at a basement on Mal’s restaurant fish Street and we put that deal together to fight that and we were successful Jeff got elected Conwell got elected cman got elected and I got reelected I was very instrumental in that I I helped Kevin and Jeff yeah broker because them two was not getting alone so I had to help broker those two together to even help us be able to put

00:13:54 that on to get that going so I’m very proud of the fact that that worked out like we said fortunate for Eugene but he was just the pawn in that whole situation he was just being used they used that’s all that’s all and so moving on I’m going to try this video one time because this was important it’s been a long day and I hadn’t anticipated rising tonight and I hadn’t anticipated saying what I’m about to say which I know will be perceived by pretty much everyone around me as a violation of trust within

00:14:22 this body but a few hours ago I got the chance to look at the proposed redistricting maps for Cleveland City Council and what I saw there was itself a violation of trust that forced my hand we serve a city that voted overwhelmingly for fair maps at the state level all of us on city council unanimously supported issue one to take map drawing out of the hands of politicians still I have tried to understand the challenging position our Charter puts us in as we vote on our own Maps as we go down from 17 council

00:14:51 members to 15 I’ve watched as the leadership of this Council talks about natural boundaries like railroads and rivers hoping that somehow those would indeed be the goals that went out indeed whenever I talked about the maps I always focused on keeping my neighborhoods whole rather than insisting that W 12 needed to stay in its exact current form however it is clear that the map I was shown today was more focused on me as a council member than on the neighborhoods of w 12 my personal residence my home in Slavic

00:15:19 Village was not only marked on the map that was shown to me but it was drawn all the way across the industrial Valley all the way across the kayaga river into the equivalent of a new Ward 3 alongside neighborhoods like Ohio city and downtown I will be upfront that this wasn’t I wonder that this might happen a couple of days ago I heard a rumor that my house was being redrawn in this way and immediately when I did I called the leadership of this body and I said to them what I will say to you I do not

00:15:46 want this I will not run from a in a h i will not run where my house is crowbar into a district that is completely different from the one that I am so proud to represent every day from what I saw today that is not what happened council president to you I say this first do not play games with my house do not play games with my street do not play games with the Forest City section of Slavic Village which so honestly deserves to be kept with the rest of Slavic Village it is that simple it is an affront to this body to even consider

00:16:22 a map that Jerry Manders a council person’s house like that I will not have it none of us should have it plain and simple second the public deserves to know what are in these Maps release a copy of this map publicly and provide a genuine chance for Resident feedback how y’ Pig down which Ward is the ward that gets eliminated it’s not even that you it’s all based on population again if the city was Square okay or rectangle you could obviously divide it up and you have 25 even though that would cross

00:16:52 some neighborhood borders and boundaries but when you’re coming in on these crazy Corners as you’re doing you start at w one got have a certain population then it affects War Two you come in from Old Brooklyn Southwest side population boom it affects the next word West Park boom greater cwood affects so at the end of the day each ward has to be plus or minus that four or 5% So I myself the last map I saw was I happy with it for my own Community absolutely not but I I know what the realities are

00:17:27 when you’re going to 13 when you going to go to 15 again I would say to the citizens goes back remember what you voted for remember what you voted for the citizens voted for this and now everybody oh is up in arms wait a minute we are mandated by law the charter is clear now would I have liked that saw a charter Amendment go on to keep it at 17 yeah but there was members in the body who didn’t want that so at the end of the day it is what it is and we’re confronted with this Domino the lines still are not solidified cuz I

00:18:03 know as of last week they the lines were still in flut trying to figure out how they could try to keep as many neighborhoods together but at the end of the day you’re going to see changes you’re going to see changes and that’s the reality and you’re going to see two WS are going to disappear two Council people are going to disappear whether anyone likes that or not that’s the reality we’re conf front with Ken wouldn’t one think that says two council members are saying they’re leaving anyway that this would been a no-brain

00:18:32 no because you go by the population okay and you’ve got to you started in Far West Side you got to get to a certain population then that affects the next word and those lines and then you have to go around basically the Hispanic Community with that horseshoe or that sea and then that effects the near West Side that effects the down fects sloy Village the sloy village and gets pushed East you come through it it’s East anyway it is farther pushed East and farther it is farther north I got you okay and just

00:19:08 again like colinwood there’s right now on the northeast side of the city there’s three Wards there’s only going to be two whether I like that or not that’s the reality that is the reality you’re going to have only two Wards on the northeast of of the sea and then the ward adjacent to that will go all the way into downtown to wow that’s what we’re confronted with and that’s what when you start to sit down and you talk and people are reason no let’s back up there some council members want to they want

00:19:39 their little Boutique that’s correct or their little bouquet or their little trendy work don’t work that way we all would like to draw our own Ward to the way we would like to have the lines drawn but the charter is clear the council the 17 members of the council will draw the lines how supposed to get 100 people per award you supposed to have 1700 people draw the lines who’s supposed to draw the lines they basically said itly and like to think and I’d like to believe unless someone can show me

00:20:13 unless someone can show me differently how that’s being violated and that council members are being denied access and input I had input into mind I don’t like them I don’t like what I see okay but I’m also confronted with I’m a realistic person the population you have to have a certain amount of population per reward so at the end of the day there are going to be Council people who don’t like it they’re going to be citizens don’t like it the lines the way to draw but I would say my brothers and sisters go back to what got

00:20:46 passed in 2008 the majority of people voted for yeah they say 60% let me ask you this when you say that how many people will be in the war’s mouth there’s about oh I’d say can you sumary about little around 22 23,000 so on the high side you’re gonna be around 26,000 about you guys will be representing the high side about 26,000 now that can vary in four four or 5% but because again the way the city lays out geographically you can’t have everybody just even but there’ll be some words a little bit

00:21:16 higher some words a little bit lower but you have to keep within that confra that frame because that way you’d be in violation of the charter interesting yeah interesting process believe me because I presided over when I was council president in ,000 2001 I was very fortunate I had all 17 members vote in support of it m wait might have been 19 I can’t remember anymore what the number was in 2000 but the fact that the matter yeah you went from 21 to 17 right yeah we went from 21 to 19 17 okay so I I think we got to

00:21:47 remember but again so it’s tough because in some cases you’re trying to keep people in their own Ward you’re right and at at the end of the day they may not be in their because of the way the do hey let’s play this other video we we going to play the response of councilman BL Griff so today was an opportunity for the council members to give input on what they thought about the maps that are proposed I’m glad that the council lady said propose maps and at the end of the day the whole goal of today was to

00:22:21 go through an exercise to have council members give suggestions which every single council member did in order to see how to find fin Maps will look I would tell you that in the process everybody had to give up things that were valuable to them I had to give up things in w six that were valuable other council members had to give up things that were valuable second thing we really tried to draw maps to eliminate as much as possible with the exception of one Ward which is Ward three the cross river boundaries now we’ll have a

00:22:55 chance to explain methodology but the fact that a council member will try to implode this issue as if this was the final document is absurd quite frankly members of this body encourage me to get rid of w 12 because they don’t trust the council member in W 12 they don’t feel that the council member in world world 12 is a team player and they feel that the council member in W 12 often times goes to the media and tries to express things outside of being a collective player in his body we have tried as a

00:23:29 leadership team to accommodate everybody in this body however this is a tough process whenever you’re redistricting it is not an easy process when you look at the map in its entirety one Ward if you move or shift something can actually throw the entire city off we all learned something through this process many members that our senior members have sacrificed for years many members who have watched this process have felt that this is probably been the most Fair transparent and open process that we have ever seen in the

00:24:03 redistricting process so I stand on the process and I think that the process was fair I think that other council members in the past have drawn the lines that they wanted to draw and I did not try to Target any individual council person but I will say that Council lady your wish is my command we’ll make sure that we don’t play any games with your house and we’ll make sure that you end up exactly where you need to be and I look forward to whatever race you have this year all right so that was councilman

00:24:37 bla Griffin response to to the councilwoman’s thing and one of the things the reason why I want to point that out is that one of the things that he said was that there were going to be people who respond to that the plane dealer responded to that with an article that day wrot bring that one up Latif you’re not going to read it but you want to show a couple of articles that came up one article came up from the plane dealer and there was another article that came up from Scene Magazine let me show you this one was the article that

00:25:08 came up from the article from cleveland.com was an article that came up that talked about saful secrecy and punitive motives during the council redistricting editorial then there was another one that came over from the from signal and sign that process and councilman Griffin he’s a big man and he was able to defend himself I want to just say two things one that the plane dealer and Signal basically looked at that and felt that they thought there was some type of ruckus among Council but from what I hear it’s not much of a

00:25:42 Ruckus from councils you got one person who was pretty much upset about the situation and what was being done and she was also offered an opportunity to be able to maybe do better what I understood is let’s go back to what I said that there are certain members that wanted to draw their own Boutique MH their own bouquet their own trendy War you just can’t do that you can’t do that What’s Happening Here is affecting everyone every member of that body especially as you get toward the core right is being affected the the extreme

00:26:19 outer edges are going to be affected somewhat until you get to the Northeast side which again is going to be affected big time because of the population loss in Glenville neighbors last 20 2% of its population Forest Hill is not much better St Clair Superior is hemorrhage population so this is the big issue we have in this city with population loss and it goes back what I’ve been saying a long time unless this Administration the bib Administration unless there is a greater attention the quality of life issues in

00:26:48 our neighborhoods including schools public safety abandoned homes code enforcement I can go right on Donal list job opportunities we’re going to Contin continue to see an Ex side of the east side because there’s been this fallacy that has existed in this city which I’ve talked about for long period of time that somehow black folks or or Eastern European folks are going to stay regardless of their circumstances wrong black folks and Eastern European folks are no different than anyone else unless

00:27:19 you can give them good schools for their kids and their grandkids unless you give them safety unless you give them quality of life shopping opportunities in their neighborhood they’re going to talk with their feet and that’s what’s happened Kenny on the east side of this city and on the Southeast side to a great extent people have talked with their feet so where have they move uid South uid Richmond Heights Warrenville Heights Bedford Heights Garfield B I could go right on the list those people who moved

00:27:45 in those Comm where do they come from they didn’t come from W Hill or gills right they came out of the east side and they left because they’re not happy with the schools they’re not happy with what’s transpiring in their neighborhoods and so unless this city Administration really steps up to the plate not only the bib Administration but going forward and starts to pay greater attention to what’s Happening Here we are in big trouble Fanny Lewis my dear great friend late friend I can remember sitting in her living room on

00:28:16 Star Avenue on numerous occasions she actually believed there was a conspiracy to to clean out the East Side Sur because of the East side’s proximity to I90 M and the late she believed it and that’s why she would never let the clinic go north of Chester now they’re north of Chester as we all know that’s correct she believe there was a conspiracy and I would we would sit in her living room and we would you know what as I look back look what’s happened to the east side something obviously because is’s no growth over

00:28:47 there we’ll bring on a couple our panelists pastor Aaron Phillips he can start getting himself back together we want to bring him on once he comes back to the camera and we have state representative Terren up church we have Pastor Phil Pastor how you doing today sir I’m doing just fine how you doing my de D and the greatest councilman ever to be here councilman C his might he is councilman I was just learning thank you for you’re educating us I was just learning today that this I always thought I told Ken I always thought this

00:29:21 was by federal guidance that we had to tie the population to the council PE but after listening to you and learning today that was something that was voted on by the charter is that something that we could take away from the charter too can we have a charter amendment to not let that to have a standing 21 Council M with no matter what the population is yet yes pastor we we could put it back on the ballot and so I I was absolutely support that I would strongly suggest that there be a a ballot issue to to

00:29:56 freeze the number of wards because if not there’s going to be continued Carnage and I will tell you that the east side will continue to take a major hit if that does not happen yes I don’t understand why we would even want to reduce it even more and thank you Council M Bo we work together to make sure that when they wanted to reduce it down to nine and you were one of the few councilmen who helped us you would Jo join John to say we don’t need to do that and thank you for all you your work really appreciate you thank you to for

00:30:28 so that at you as a release to one of the other R this is saying to that hous um n profice the cdcs is this no bers for see they no they have geographical boundaries but those borders can change at any time change the borders so I this there’s really no argument to be made about the cdc’s cdc’s can change their boundaries they can work together and unfortunately in the past a lot of cdc’s have not worked together have not worked together plus there’s whole lot of issues let’s be just be very blunted I’m always very

00:31:08 blunt to the point the one of the biggest challenges we have with the cdc’s on each side and many them are dysfunctional man let’s PR blun about that they’re dysfunctional and they’ve been dysfunctional and unless you have competent boards unless you have good staff then they become more focused nothing will change cuz you look at the decline in many neighborhoods it’s tied directly to ineffective Community Development Corporation or a lack of a Community Development that’s what I say is lack of yeah I got we gonna bring on

00:31:39 our other panelist now we got our full team here we got state representative Terence Upchurch in the house Terrence how you doing state representative hey I’m good good to be with everybody Pastor Philips always good to see you Iron Mike is always to be with you that’s what we call it in Colwood uh Iron Mike see our money so state representative your um reason I brought you on was because I know that at one point in time you were actively involved in trying to uh we were all involved in trying to be

00:32:13 a part of that citizens not politicians and we were looking in full support of helping them to get that on the ballot and a lot of that had to do with the fact that the state seem to have issues and trying to get that thing done on their own and we felt that maybe the citizens ought to come in based off of that going through that situation and what you’ve been reading about with City councils going through what’s your thoughts on this redistricting thing and everything that’s taking place yeah I I think any redistricting

00:32:43 process is always going to be a challenge whether you’re doing at the state level uh or at the local level and there’s always the guidelines and the parameters that you have to follow within I I’m not too familiar with the city’s process more familiar with the process at the legislative level but the city unfortunately as the councilman said the greatest challenge that we have is the population loss we are a city that’s built for a million plus people and like the councilman said we have less than half of that so this is a a

00:33:14 phenomenon going to continue unless we can really address some of the issues that are impacting our population law and that’s certainly been the driving force of some of the work that I’ve done at the legislative level to help the city uh improveed services so that the residents have a better quality of life so that we can attract more people back into the city of Cleveland Ken I want to say I want to say something about signno and the plane dealer being critical of the current council president dealing with redistri

00:33:46 tap and I I think that that’s why I was going with councilman pinic that most people don’t even know why we even do the redition and how it came to be that issue 39 that you were talking about most people don’t even know that and I think it was very irresponsible for an editorial in a in a newspaper to not even really include the full story and then they didn’t want to say there something sneaky going on with behind closed doors when we know that’s not true our council president is not like that and I wanted uh to be one of the

00:34:19 first people to stand up for him I that he needs me too but I believe in supporting we need to learn how to support each other he’s doing a magnificent job not only in the city C council chambers but also in our community and I know he’s not the kind of person that the folks were back then when they got rid of Eugene Miller poor UG and I will tell you I thank God for councilman blank Griffin I know that’s a tough job and I I really if I had known what I know now I would have been getting out petitions I know some a dear

00:34:47 friend of mine was talking about getting petitions out to get rid of issue 24 I would get a petition out right now not to get rid of the issue 24 but to get issue to make sure that we maintain at least 17 council members at least 17 or really 21 because we need more people we need more representation not less representation and I think that’s what really needs to be talked about so instead of talking about it really needs to be talking about people want to blame others folks and have these red hearings

00:35:16 and cry I don’t understand that and especially for another council person and and that’s what we really got to get rid of here in politics especially in Cleveland you don’t come out on the public floor and start izing uh you’re a fellow council member that’s just horrible and that and that’s a bad look bad example for what we need to be happening in our community in our city why don’t we learn how to work together and we and stand together and be unified and clean up the and clean up the streets of mov make our schools better

00:35:46 and make our and our make Cleveland a safer uh place for people to want to come and move here and I’m not just talking that I live in the city of Cleveland I’m not one I Pastor in the city of Cleveland and I live in the city of Cleveland I’m not one of these pastors that have a a nice Church in the city and then go out in the suburbs to spend my money I believe in our city and we need to learn how to work together and not have all this Ruckus that and this the this division that is trying to happen through the to this media so we

00:36:13 going to have that video Mr chairman everybody wants to go to heaven but nobody wants to die okay there is going to be some pain at the pump here there are going to be some neighborhoods of affected they’re going to be council members affected the blinds are not drawn at least I hope they’re not cuz I haven’t seen a final drawings and that’s what I keep asking myself what’s on social media or what is people putting out there to cause this outrage andless there’s conspiracy crap going on here there’s something clandestine going on I

00:36:52 don’t get in are people going to like it at the end of the day I can assure you at least two aren’t maybe more than that but we have to do what is right that’s the charter that’s what happened when there was a charter change in the people voted for it and I find it I find it interesting now that some people who are now are outraged at lot jaw what this happened last night it’s like they stepped on a rusty nail and he couldn’t say crap now they’re outraged by it so at the end of the day Mr chairman this is a tough

00:37:29 decision I appreciate what you’re trying to do I might not like it myself at the end of the day but you know what I’m going to live with it and I’m following up on your remarks that you made on city council floor as it relates to the the work that bla Griffin and city council is doing again I go back I don’t mix no words with me everybody knows which is what you get if I felt that Blain was doing something dastardly or underhandedly I’d say it cuz what are they going to do to me mhm nobody’s going to do nothing to me mhm okay I I

00:37:59 do what I have to do on behalf of our citizens not only people in my own word but Citywide I thought he’s been as Fair as he possibly could he’s been a good council president and I know CU I was in that position at one time it’s like you’re hurting cats at times believe me when I tell you you’re dealing with different personalities you’re dealing with different individual he has tried to do his best by this effort to bring all these people down to the council member to criticize him under public

00:38:25 comment I I was very alarmed and concerned because I also saw as some of my other East Side council members saw there there was a racial undercurrent as well okay that somehow that no that this neighborhood on the Slavic Village here and around it’s got to be protected at the expense of of the other East Side WS no it don’t work that way there’s going to be pain at the pump pain at the pump do I like what’s happening no as I’ve said earlier you couldn’t do no more than that than colinwood or anywhere

00:38:57 else the case so exactly so I’m not happy with the w lines that I see right now there because they’re still in flux right but at the end of the day blame his tried to do the best job he can based on what he’s dealing with we have a balanced budget we have committees that are functioning and operating probably better than they ever have within the council the O from standpoint of oversight as chair of Public Safety he’s never once said to me no I don’t want you asking this you shouldn’t be doing it do what has to be done about

00:39:26 transparency professional conduct accountability that’s how I’ve carried the committee on so he’s tried and for him to be attacked like he was not only by a member of council but by people who came down from a specific area and again there’s people who want to they want to draw their little trendy neighborhood at the expense of everybody else no that don’t work my friends that don’t work that way there’s there is going to be pain there’s going to be two WS disappearing do I like that absolutely

00:39:56 not and I believe I hope after this point that we can mobilize and get a issue on the ballot that’s going to freeze the member of council because if not we’re going to continue to pay a severe price in this city and not a good price I can tell you that right now that that was one of the comments that councilwoman Spencer brought up at the end of hers that she wanted to see a resolution that would come up that would allow them to freeze the number of council members or something that better process right I advocated that for L but

00:40:27 then there were people in the who didn’t want that you have to get the votes to put it on the ballot okay and then again in light of the fact that the people voted 60% to 40% for this new process could in fact okay pastor philli what do you think um council is missing in it as it relates to trying to get this redistricting thing done or do you think there’s something council could have did different or you would like them to do I appreciate our Council people however the only reason I know that is because I

00:40:58 am really engaged in what’s happening in the city of Cleveland politically and government and all that but for your average person who’s out here who’s not who’s got other things on their mind other than politics in the government we have no idea what uh good work that Mike pinic is doing on a daily basis I think that if there was a way that the council could get a someone to project out to let them know get their message out what a great job they’re doing how what their job is how they can be further engaged

00:41:29 they need a real a good PR person really to let to highlight all the great things that they’re doing so there people million people don’t even understand why we need city council and I remember a fighting that fight when they wanted to reduce and is and listen Tony George is a very dear friend of mine I love Tony George and I I say that all the time to people he’s a good friend of mine and he’s a brother to me and he wanted to reduce city council and I said man we can’t do that and so we worked through

00:41:58 that and with councilman pinc and councilman Joe Jones and we we got together got the community Together We Got Each Other talking to each other the ministers and the the even then the the congresswoman Marsha thel bring all of us together remember that councilman politic brought us all together and we sat down at the table and we worked through that and but many people in this community don’t even know that story for one and it’s not because it’s not told enough and many people in the community

00:42:25 do not know what and why we need to have good qualified Council people representing the community on a regular basis and know what their job is and that’s what is very important that we get in front of the Tam and let people know what the city council members are doing what great job they’re doing and get in front of that so people will not know may we all we everyone will feel the same way that I feel there’s no way we need to reduce counsel if anything else we need more not less because the job that we need to have done we need

00:42:56 the best people on debt right now to get this job done and I think you when you reduce the city council that means you’re giving a council person more geographical area to have to cover and then that makes their job even harder why are there elements in our community especially within the corporate Community who want to have Council reduced so they can control it because then it cost more money to raer city council forever whoever runs and therefore people who have the fat checkbooks have greater control ultimately who gets

00:43:35 elected I’m just telling you the way it is see at this point there’s nothing no one’s what no one’s going to do anything to me at this point in my political life I every election I’ve run in I’ve my the the worst I’ve done is 77% okay I’ve done as high as 98% in an election but I will tell you there are elements in our community who want to control City Council they want to control who gets elected and they and if when they have the fat checkbooks they can control who is elected and ultimately who will do

00:44:05 their bidding not on behalf of our citizens I want to say not on behalf of our citizens our churches our institutions but for their best interest that will be a disaster and I will tell you this I would argue to point look where we’re at today we are the poor city in the country we have among the in number one or number two in childhood poverty we have lost substantial amount of jobs we’ve seen a whole bunch of schools closed especially on the east side of the city where is the concern out of the corporate Community as a

00:44:35 pertains to making improving the quality of life I don’t see it I call it like I like it is where is that concern to really reimagine and remake Cleveland I don’t see it coming all we keep talking about we got to reduce representation we got to reduce representation and what do we get as a result of it very little Improvement I want to go ahead and um move around one more question question through there Council Pastor Phillips I’m going to tell you why I say it it seems like to me that Cleveland City

00:45:04 Council takes the blunt of all the what’s wrong with what’s going on in the city as it relates to anytime something is going wrong that’s happening in the city and it seems like the mayor’s office doesn’t get any criticism for any other things not the mayor office would probably say oh that’s lie we get criticized for a whole lot of stuff we do and I guess it’s much that’s wrong that everybody’s pointing the finger at everybody around everything these days that’s going on but I want to say to you

00:45:34 just because you mentioned something and we rounding out on this one that communication is the key and that’s the thing that I tell bla a lot about is getting that information out so that the public can be a part of that and understand what is going on the citizens who come down who wants to be a play a role in being a part of some of the legislative duties that we elect and pay people to do versus getting part of things in their community that they can do for free that can help better the community that they should be involved

00:46:05 in that they chose not to get involved in I want to ask a question to you and I’m gonna let you answer that question and give us your closing remarks while we at it and what do you see or what do you believe that you mentioned communication what do you believe you got councilman sitting here the overall sentiment that you get from your members and others as it relates to council and the mayor and and what’s going on in I think one of the best things that the city council has done Ken was is to allow public comment there was a long

00:46:36 time that you couldn’t even go you go to City Council meetings but if you were a member of the public you couldn’t speak and they did that for just not until Mr Griff had became the council president they had opened that mic up that and that goes to show of a good leadership of our Council current council president because you need to be engaging and opening up to the public so I want to talk I want to just mention that they are starting to understand how important it is to get the public involved and

00:47:05 engaged because that’s how you will garish support I think they we could have I’ve been knowing about the redistricting process because that’s my job to keep up with things but if I had to talk to my neighbor right next door to me he wouldn’t know he wouldn’t have a clue sh about about redistricting that any of that I think if we would have had some kind of conversations prior to even though was the job of the city council people to make those decisions but it would have been good to have some public

00:47:32 input and get it out in front of people and start talking about it so we’re just not talking about it now why it’s going on but that would have been an excellent conversation to be having why we were uh doing the 2024 election and that’s some something we should have been talking about but that’s not for us the council should be more engaging more more confident people and I want to just say a comment about councilman penit because I think we don’t really understand when he says he’s been there

00:47:59 the longest and he knows he’s been through this process you would think if you’re in and I bet you many people in our community would think that councilman pic is a councilman on the west side over some white people but that is the exact opposite I’ve been to his Ward one of the nicest Wards in our community and the majority of his member the his neighborhood is are black people and because he is speaking our language when little ladies who need to come to my church they don’t want to be robbed

00:48:30 one the church and I he was the only councilman who stood up and said something about that I called him on the phone you remember that c Poli I left him a message cuz I didn’t hear anybody else talking about that I called him on the phone said Thank you for taking up Ro to you cist I sure did I left him a message because he represents us so that’s what I think if we would follow that model to get engaged and get people to know know who are counselor AR know what the work that they’re doing know

00:49:00 what have they are wanting to protect our community you we need to be follow that model key and being in touch with our community you don’t stay that long with those I can you say this what the late great Lou Stokes said to me so often cuz he knew I how I helped his brother and Lou always helped me but he said Mike one day I was sitting with him at the old call post office with the late joh laner Lou said to me Michael never forget where you came from and never forget who you represent I’ve never

00:49:30 forgotten that’s what I live every day Pastor philis we’re gonna let you close us out with your last remarks of on the comment then we’re gonna have councilman give us his close and remarks and we gonna get up out of here get us out of here exactly on hour go ahead I just want to uh say let’s really learn how to work together as a community to really transform our community it’s not just going to be the elected officials can’t just be clergy people it just can’t be the business community and it

00:50:00 just can’t be the community activeness it takes all of us to come together to transfer our community and that’s what we need to be doing everyone staying in their own lane and knowing how to work together and I would really wish we would look at this as a team effort because when you’re a team effort when there’s something going wrong on the team you don’t put that out on the field you take care of that in the lock R and so if we have some issues that need to be taken care of let’s take them care of

00:50:27 them in the locker room I don’t want to see my public officials squandering fighting over little stuff like this redist has to happen because by law so there’s no reason we should be out here arguing like that that’s that has to happen so and know there are times that we may have to disagree publicly I get that but most of the time most people like us are we are are average person wants to see our community and our community leaders working together for the positive of our community and that’s what I’m striving for in 2025 let’s

00:51:00 learn how to work together uh so we can really real bring real transformation to our community councilman I want to thank you for coming on our program again it was very educational I think you gave us a lot of good information that we can go on to get out there to the masses if you want to get more information on how you can get in touch with councilman Michael pinc we’ll have all of that information in the description and below and there you can then get an opportunity to see what Michael penc is actually doing in

00:51:24 this community he represent the Collinwood area and so you want to keep your eye out also he’s on the Safety Committee and we’ll have him back to talk safety that’s a really big issue and that’s a really hot topic and all the things that they’re doing in that Safety Committee so councilman before we leave this is your camera right here we going to give you an opportunity you can take your time to say whatever you want to say to the people I first of all I’m very proud and honor to represent the

00:51:48 NorthShore cwood cwood Village in East Glenville T grew up in I was born in the Glenville neighborhoods this is my home I’ve never lived any place other than the east side and what I want more than ever before is please become engaged care about what happens than is happening on your street try to get invol there’s a street Club black Club neighbor Association whatever it may beward Club get invol as much as you can people can and will make a difference we need more stakeholders we need more people believing in Cleveland caring

00:52:20 about our city if we are really going to REM make this town and how we all would like to see it with safe neighborhoods quality schools retail opportunities Banks and Etc in our neighbors we all can become engaged more than ever before we should never take anything for granted too many people have taken our neighborhoods for granted until it’s too late and then they turn around and they realize it’s gone it’s not there and then they talk with their feet Cleveland is a city believe me what we say but it

00:52:49 can be a great City if we want it to be a great City not only we have to care about each other but we got to convince the corporate community the people as I said earlier with the fat checkbooks we got to convince them to become stakeholders to become Believers to to partner with us so we can really make a difference the question I ask myself and I say to my citizens all how far are we supposed to run where do we run to are AR aren’t we here to save our churches and our institutions and our neighbor

00:53:19 aren’t we here to remember our roots and I’m very much aware of the fact as I’m I’m a historian the migration from the deep south of African-American Community moved to Cleveland my own family came from Eastern Europe we came here to Cleveland not for palm trees and beaches we came for jobs and opportunities let’s do what we can to create those jobs and those opportunities and the quality school system that we once had many decades ago let’s work together collectively to make Cleveland the best

00:53:48 it can be and during this holiday season only else I can say is you know I I wish everybody a blessed Christmas a joyous uh uh Quanza and a again and a blessed um Hanukkah we need to care about each other that’s all I can tell you that this is a good City we just need to have good people stand up and support it and on that note Kenny I want to thank you for the invitation as always I appreciate what you do thanks on behalf of our citizens because it is about getting the message out it’s about educating our citizens so again I’m here

00:54:22 at this point in my life I want to do what is right I I I’ve always tried to do what right but as I get older I care about what’s going to happen to Cleveland I I care greatly about the future of this city and I’m a believer I’m a Believer so again God bless you my brother I appreciate that coming from you councilman I really do man and I can say I look forward to working with you every time we think Mike penic is out he’s back again Brothers he’s gonna run again y’all he ain’t going nowhere don’t

00:54:49 know what he’s he said don’t know but trust me don’t worry you don’t want be S right here in this as long as he can do he G do you’re doing well man and and right now we call you the consciousness of the black community so you and you don’t know that but that’s what we call you I represent a RAB black Bo for over 36 years nobody else in this city or in this county has done that and L Stokes would say he would say that to me all day Michael just keep doing what you’re doing I said Lou he would always be the

00:55:23 first person I’d call when I’d run for a election he would say what do you call me before I said what’s out of respect he says I know what you did for my brother I know what your mother did for my brother you’ve always been with us the Stokes family’s always going to be with you and they were every time I ran he was with me and I’ve just been I’ve been blessed I’ve been blessed to have that kind of support in my community again never under 77% when I run for re-election and think about that in 46

00:55:49 and A2 years wow never under that wow and as high as 98% in an election wow and who support me what precincts support me the greatest the predominantly black precincts in my wh that’s excellent that means you’re doing good by that tells you a whole lot right tell you’re doing good by the people man and that’s what’s important we appreciate you man and we look forward to you and we’ll have him back on our show so next week we’ll see you guys soon peace thank you good job man thank you